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Finally Found Something That Works...


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#61 Rembolt

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Posted 06 July 2020 - 10:39 PM

If this is a new in the box rifle .and it will not shoot a 3 shot moa group with premium factory ammo you should be talking to tikka . as that is one of there specs . it is strange that you can not get good results with a more suited .308 win powder . 4895h imr4895 or imr4064 all basicly designed with the .308 in mind .
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Citori 725 Sporting

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#62 KEVIN

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 06:41 AM

4 GRAINS OVER MAX ???????????????   THAT'S DAMN NEAR A WHOLE PRESSURE RANGE IN SOME CALIBERS....GLAD IT WAS YOUR FACE THERE !!

 

THE ONE THING EVERY RELOADING MANUAL & RELOADER ( WITH READING CAPABILITY AND ANY COMMON SENSE WARNS YOU ABOUT...OVER MAX LOADS....YOU RAN RIGHT UP THERE AND DID  !!  AS A NEW RELOADER...YOU FAILED !

 

THE OLD EXPRESSION ...CURIOSITY KILLED THE CAT APPLIES HERE.

 

ROB.....YOUR'RE A WHOLE LOT MORE CARELESSLY STOOPID THAN I EVER GAVE YOU CREDIT FOR  !!!


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If you take your kids hunting,.....You won't have to go hunting for your kids.....KS/85

#63 1NSH Dave

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 09:18 AM

I have a feeling, I hope, that he meant .4gr

Since he also wrote that he made loads in 2gr increments, which I think he meant .2gr.

At least I am really hoping that’s the case. Lol. And that’s why you have to be careful when reading internet info. Typos are easy to make.
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Time to start hunting them coyotes, I think!!!!

#64 Joyrider

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 10:32 AM

4 GRAINS OVER MAX ???????????????   THAT'S DAMN NEAR A WHOLE PRESSURE RANGE IN SOME CALIBERS....GLAD IT WAS YOUR FACE THERE !!

 

THE ONE THING EVERY RELOADING MANUAL & RELOADER ( WITH READING CAPABILITY AND ANY COMMON SENSE WARNS YOU ABOUT...OVER MAX LOADS....YOU RAN RIGHT UP THERE AND DID  !!  AS A NEW RELOADER...YOU FAILED !

 

THE OLD EXPRESSION ...CURIOSITY KILLED THE CAT APPLIES HERE.

 

ROB.....YOUR'RE A WHOLE LOT MORE CARELESSLY STOOPID THAN I EVER GAVE YOU CREDIT FOR  !!!

Ha!  Sorry sorry sorry!  0.4gn  ;-)

Don't make me take away your caps key Kev.  ;-)   

Next time go with your gut - you assumed I was more sensible, run with that assumption and ask next time my friend.  ;-)

I was nervous with the 0.4, believe me, 4gn would make me run.

Rob


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#65 Joyrider

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 10:33 AM

If this is a new in the box rifle .and it will not shoot a 3 shot moa group with premium factory ammo you should be talking to tikka . as that is one of there specs . it is strange that you can not get good results with a more suited .308 win powder . 4895h imr4895 or imr4064 all basicly designed with the .308 in mind .

True, but it's really close with the federal prem stuff and I'm sure if I tried a couple of more brands (as long as it's not 150gn!) I am sure it would.  


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#66 Joyrider

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 10:42 AM

Well now that is surprising to hear about the sierras!!

I am hoping you forgot to add the decimals in your numbers? Lol. I just about collapsed when I read 4 grains over max!!!!!!

I think you’re onto a good plan so I don’t have much more to add. But I will speak to the first shot flyer you’re experiencing. You may hear some people start saying it’s a “cold bore shot” that goes different. It’s rubbish. Two possibilities for a first shot going astray: 1 if the barrel and chamber is newly cleaned it will very likely change the point of impact. Obviously that’s not the issue as you said this happened from group to group, unless your swabbing between groups? 2 it’s you, unfortunately. Lol. No sugar coating.

The term cold bore shot should be changed to “cold shooter shot”. It just means that you weren’t perfectly set up. It’s a lot easier to notice when shooting a string of semi auto fire as you don’t move between them at all. With a bolt gun you move between shots anyway. But what is going on is that you’re not perfectly naturally aligned and after the initial shots you’re getting settled in.

What you can do next time is part of the marksmanship training we give our guys on the army rifle team called natural alignment. This can be done as practice dry but also can be done with the rifle loaded and ready to fire your group.

Get in your firing position and once you are aimed and set close both eyes for a few seconds and relax (still holding as if you’re going to fire). Now open your eye and look through the site. Is your crosshair still exactly where you had it aimed? Don’t be surprised if it isn’t. What happens is that without your visual input your body relaxes to where it naturally is holding the rifle. Your subconscious mind will make your muscles “push” the rifle onto target when you’re aiming. This push will translate into a stray shot.

The answer is to do that trick, and then when you open your eye and see the crosshair off target DO NOT just move the gun back on target. You need to shift your body to lay the crosshair back on. It can be something dramatic like scootching over a bit or it can be as subtle as moving one elbow a quarter inch. Make the adjustment, settle in, close eyes, open and see where you’re at. Continue this “test and adjust” until when you open your eyes the crosshair is still naturally on target. We call this marksmanship principle 2: the weapon and body must be naturally aligned to the target without any undo stress.

I know it’s sounds complicated but once you try it you’ll see it really is simple. The more you do it the quicker it gets and you will be closer to naturally aligned from the start as you continue on.

Make sure you include everything in your shooting posture in the test. Such as how you grip the rifle, how you breath, how you pull the rifle to your shoulder etc.

Good luck!

Wow!  Thanks for the great tips!  I am always looking for ways to improve, that natural alignment makes a lot of sense, i am looking forward to trying it out!

I find the chester benches (which are really quite nice!) a little too low for me so am not really "settled in" so to speak.  I was thinking of bringing something to put on it to raise up the whole top.  I might toss something into the truck to try next time just to see if it helps along with your tip.

Re the "first shot off" thing, you are right about the very first of the day - it is the worst one.  Me or the gun, not sure....?  When rifle season opens up we have a lead sled at the camp I'll try.  I generally don't like it and rarely touch it, but if I get it all set up and do a group I can take most of the "me" out of the equation.  I'll try that in the fall - it may give some hints for future development.  I don't clean between groups but do see the 1st shot go off in the same direction with most groups (first seems the most)  but will start to record it and see if the data shows anything.  Maybe it gets less as the session goes on (that still wouldn't answer the "gun or me" question, but more data to help).

Thanks again, I find your tips really useful so far.  :-)

Rob


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#67 Moose Magoo

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 11:24 AM


Don't make me take away your caps key Kev.  ;-)   

Rob

 

 I didn’t need a second cup of Joe this morning after seeing not only caps but bold as well.   Like my mother used to say “I  NEED TO GET YOUR ATTENTION!” lol. 


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......... and Trudeau says "the budget will balance itself" 


#68 1NSH Dave

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 02:57 PM

You could also buy some cheap projectiles and load some “warm up ammo”. Don’t worry too much about workin a load for them. Just something to load and go bang. Just to get you settled in. We all like to say we don’t flinch or jerk the trigger and all that but if we were dead honest we all do it sometimes. By simply getting some rounds downrange first you get the jitters out, as minor a small they may be, before getting into the good stuff.

I have a box of cheap Speer projectiles loaded with me every time just for that. And cheap as they are they shoot sub Moa all day.
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Time to start hunting them coyotes, I think!!!!

#69 KEVIN

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 09:04 AM

Rob...you're right.."ass u me" has claimed another victim. ME !  Glad I got your attention tho  cool.png cool.png

 

Yesterday, I read and RE-READ your post again and again...all the while thinking...jaysus, he knows better for sure. He did mention that he saw a decent load near max values...I was allllllmost gonna give you the benefit of the doubt...then you stuck that word...GULP right in there after the all alone (non-decimalized)  4

 

that's when I caved and agreed with ass u me rolleyes.gif rolleyes.gif

 

Sorry for the drama...LOL...I'll take 50% of it for jumping the gun...the other 50% goes straight to the clerical department !!


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If you take your kids hunting,.....You won't have to go hunting for your kids.....KS/85

#70 Joyrider

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 01:00 PM

 

Sorry for the drama...LOL...I'll take 50% of it for jumping the gun...the other 50% goes straight to the clerical department !!

 

:-)  Fair enough.  When should I start grading your posts for grammar and spelling....?  ;-)

Feel free to chime in on the content of the post too, I know you do a lot (lot!) of reloading, you are one of the people I was hoping would weigh in.

R


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