83 replies to this topic

[ttc]

Trudeau and Blair BAN 12 Gauge and 10 Gauge SHOTGUNS!

The Canadian Shooting Sports Association and the Canadian Sporting Arms and Ammunition Association demand the immediate withdrawal of the Liberal's flawed Order in Council.

May 5, 2020



Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and Minister Bill Blair looked Canadian gun owners in the eye last Friday and said they would not take guns suitable for hunting away from us.

Mr. Blair is either too inept to comprehend the scope of his new regulations...or he lied to the Government and Canadians.

In the legal opinion of our firearms team - headed by Edward Burlew L.L.B., one of the foremost experts in Canadian firearms law - Bill Blair banned almost every modern 12-gauge and 10-gauge shotgun in Canada with removable chokes because they exceed the maximum bore diameter of 20 mm as defined in SOR/2020-96.

Canada's firearms industry body, the CSAAA, advises retailers to cease sales of many 12-gauge or larger shotguns with removable chokes."

It is estimated there are 1.5 - 2 million of the common hunting firearms in Canada.

As well, many large bore hunting rifles - some over 100 years old and valued over $100,000 have become prohibited. None of these firearms are semi-automatic or "military style." They encompass common bolt-action rifles such as the .460 Weatherby, break-open single and double rifles. These firearms are captured because the powerful cartridges they shoot - designed to humanely dispatch the largest game animals. PURE hunting rifles.

CSAAA also advises retailers to stop sales of "large hunting calibre, non semi-automatic rifles such as the Weatherby Mark V .460 as these rifles exceed the 10,000 Joules energy restriction.

Despite open hunting seasons across much of Canada, lawful firearms owners should refrain from using 12-gauge or larger shotguns with removable chokes or large calibre rifles capable of exceeding the government's energy ceiling.

These firearms are PROHIBITED and may not be used or transported for any reason.

Intentional lies or incompetent mistakes? You decide.

The Canadian Shooting Sports Association (CSSA) and the Canadian Sporting Arms and Ammunition Association (CSAAA) demand the immediate withdrawal of the Liberal's flawed Order in Council and the resignation of Public Safety Minister, Bill Blair.

[3macs1]

Yes I posted it here earlier and commented as such

 

Sorry Walter to be negative again but we just reached a new level of stupid and it comes from those who I have paid for years in hope they would help us, They can kiss my membership good bye so I have one left now in canada CCFR

Who in the F'k shoots a threaded choke tubed barrel with no choke some one that doesn't want to use their gun again maybe 

 

 

It was just removed from Nutz and for obvious reasons. The boys that know shotguns were just shaking their heads as I am

 Shotgun bores are not measured  as such

 Take care

[Buckmark]

Chit is going to hit the fan. There are a ton of gun owners out there, that the original ban did not affect. I guarantee a whole lot more people have 12 gauge shotguns that fall into this category, than the “military style” category. Where will it end ?????? This HITLER needs to be stopped !!!

[3macs1]

Chit is going to hit the fan. There are a ton of gun owners out there, that the original ban did not affect. I guarantee a whole lot more people have 12 gauge shotguns that fall into this category, than the “military style” category. Where will it end ?????? This HITLER needs to be stopped !!!

For what this is 100% wrong as written. Oh wait a lawyer was involved with the CSSA  so it must be correct

Lets see in a few weeks OK

 

Negative Joe has to step back for a while from here. Don't need a stroke  . I am not the brightest bulb in the pack but not this dim either especially when firearms are being discussed. 

 

I hate saying rumors but it has been said CSSA membership drive to get  hunters etc on board . Humm

 

Take care

[Buckmark]

I hope this is just a technical oversight. I think ... for whatever that matters ... if you get caught with a shotgun that doesn’t have a choke in it ... you get charged. If you have a choke in it ... it brings the bore diameter below the legal limit ... so we are ok. Most of today’s shotguns are sold with interchangeable chokes. This would be total BS and a chit show if this was a reality. There goes the buy back program .... it just quadrupled and then some. 

[3macs1]

I hope this is just a technical oversight. I think ... for whatever that matters ... if you get caught with a shotgun that doesn’t have a choke in it ... you get charged. If you have a choke in it ... it brings the bore diameter below the legal limit ... so we are ok. Most of today’s shotguns are sold with interchangeable chokes. This would be total BS and a chit show if this was a reality. There goes the buy back program .... it just quadrupled and then some. 

All the pre 1987 fixed choke shotguns guns which is roughly when choke tubes started are fine as is unless you sawed the choke off of one. After that they are measured with with tubes not like this guy says

Playing with words for what ever reason

 Think of it this way if right every 12ga and 10ga shotgun made since 1987 to shoot steel shot would be on the banned list. You are talking millions and closing many hunting seasons such as all Federal migratory duck and goose right across canada Not part of the plan even for Justin and not happening

See now it is BS

Take care

[ingo999]

Hunters need to stand with sport shooters . Many hunters blew this off as not affecting them. You see now how dangerous it’s become. Join one of Canada’s gun advocates like the CCFR. We need to fight this.

[3macs1]

Hunters need to stand with sport shooters . Many hunters blew this off as not affecting them. You see now how dangerous it’s become. Join one of Canada’s gun advocates like the CCFR. We need to fight this.

Agree join the CCFR

 Cheers

[682bubba]

Agree join the CCFR

 Cheers

I did yesturday..

[Tyson10gauge]

I just seen this after getting from up on the roof ready to redo it over , HOLY FKN FK ! , just counted 2g for new 10 semi , like why the flying fk is this crap .


It's ok for one to smoke dope , drink till your oblivious , have some sort of mental disorder or what ever , be a draw on the public health care system cause your liver and lungs are screwed from legal booze and weed , but NOOOO can't be gun owner !

Time for this dictator step down , he just committed political suicide , and Joe don't say it won't cost him votes , really don't give a fk right now what you say ! Cause negativness right now is not what we need.

.416 bolt action hunting rifles gone and do on , putting it in fancy words like 10,000 joules , or 20 mm or greater , ffs I've got collection since 87 of newer water fowl guns I'd say 15 k easy maybe more . What the actual fk gonna shoot water fowl with now , friggin pellet rifle , oh wait shoots lead and need lic for anything over 500' let second , guess that next in chopping block .

These sleazy fkrs knew exactly how they would go after hunters firearms under the "Assault Gun Ban " don't kid your self wait , the fkn hand gun ban is coming , let's see what other chitt they pull off without parliamentary process .


Oh last note if you support liberalism or are a closet one , chop your guns up now and Choke on the fkn pieces !

[3macs1]

I just seen this after getting from up on the roof ready to redo it over , HOLY FKN FK ! , just counted 2g for new 10 semi , like why the flying fk is this crap .


It's ok for one to smoke dope , drink till your oblivious , have some sort of mental disorder or what ever , be a draw on the public health care system cause your liver and lungs are screwed from legal booze and weed , but NOOOO can't be gun owner !

Time for this dictator step down , he just committed political suicide , and Joe don't say it won't cost him votes , really don't give a fk right now what you say ! Cause negativness right now is not what we need.

.416 bolt action hunting rifles gone and do on , putting it in fancy words like 10,000 joules , or 20 mm or greater , ffs I've got collection since 87 of newer water fowl guns I'd say 15 k easy maybe more . What the actual fk gonna shoot water fowl with now , friggin pellet rifle , oh wait shoots lead and need lic for anything over 500' let second , guess that next in chopping block .

These sleazy fkrs knew exactly how they would go after hunters firearms under the "Assault Gun Ban " don't kid your self wait , the fkn hand gun ban is coming , let's see what other chitt they pull off without parliamentary process .


Oh last note if you support liberalism or are a closet one , chop your guns up now and Choke on the fkn pieces !

Crap is right. Your 10ga is fine as you will see as is your waterfowl collection as long as you didnot saw any barrels off

 hunting 416?? I Don't think so IMHO 416 rigby around 6500 joules and the 416 barrett  hunting version around 8500. Yes the 416 barrett sniper would be over 10k so banned

the only shotguns hit by the 20mm  would be the 8ga and who in the hell has one of those since they have been banned for waterfowl since 1918

Take care

[Tripple D]

Lots of focus on the shotguns what about my 460 and what other large caliber rifles are actuall effected

[Tripple D]

Hunters need to stand with sport shooters . Many hunters blew this off as not affecting them. You see now how dangerous it’s become. Join one of Canada’s gun advocates like the CCFR. We need to fight this.

It’s all in the wording.Make it difficult for people to easily understand and you win the battle a lot easier.

[adam_h]

I read the legal brief that all this bullshit is based on.  the lawyer came to the conclusion that the barrel/bore ends at the point the removable choke/threads start and that the choke is not part of the barrel.  Therefore, if we remove the choke, measure something that is NOT the barrel and apply the barrel regulations to a NOT-barrel then shotguns are prohibited.  Lawyers are paid for opinions, not to be accurate or correct.  His is wrong by his own logic/arguments.

[3macs1]

Bill  Blair

 

Earlier today, the

@CSSA_CILA

issued a statement alleging that our government is banning 12 and 10 gauge shotguns. This is absolutely incorrect and we will be reaching out to them to correct their misunderstanding. (1/2)

 

 

8:10 PM · May 5, 2020·Twitter Web App

25

Retweets

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Bill Blair

 

@BillBlair

·

1h

 

Replying to

@BillBlair

Both 10 and 12 gauge shotguns are under the 20mm provision, and thus not subject to the prohibition. Our government is taking action to protect Canadians by banning assault-style weapons – not those used for hunting. The truth matters. (2/2)

[3macs1]

The big question is has everyone hugged their 12ga  and 10ga tonight. If not please do been a strange stressful 24 hours

[caperaway]

Legally I'd say Burlew is right as the choke is screwed in and removable therefore an accessory not actually part of the gun. The precedent for this would come from the Firearms lab refusing to accept pinned and welded extensions to barrels as sufficient to increase barrel length and also barrels being measured without their threaded on flash suppressors to determine legal barrel length. It's been common practice in the firearms lab to measure things in the strictest sense of the law and give the public no leeway or benefit of the doubt. If they apply this to the shotguns then,yes the barrel has an internal diameter greater than 20mm and as such is Prohibited. It doesn't matter that people would never fire the gun without the choke tube,the firearms lab has proven time and again that they don't care about common sense. Just look at the crazy crap they do to make anything prohibited like using baling wire and duct tape to put an upper on a some prohibited lower to get it to fire one shot so it can be classed as "easily converted".

 

In reality Blair and Trudeau are probably shitting their pants after realizing they fucked up and unknowingly made 12g shotguns prohibited and are now stating they are not prohibited to try to save their asses as they know they will be destroyed next election if this is true. I'd like to see some other lawyers opinions. All it takes is one over zealous cop and prosecutor and we have a precedent that will cause no end of headaches for the Liberals.

[Rembolt]

This really is a matter of interpretation . if you interpretate that the bore is any part of the barrel that shot or projectile passes through . then yes the section of the barrel that retains the choke is also the bore . according to a post from Blair this is not the interpatation used .

[KEVIN]

If they had HALF a GD clue about general firearms they'd be dangerous !!  Those two are soooo fekked it isn't even funny !!!! 

[3macs1]

This really is a matter of interpretation . if you interpretate that the bore is any part of the barrel that shot or projectile passes through . then yes the section of the barrel that retains the choke is also the bore . according to a post from Blair this is not the interpatation used .

You have been around shotguns a long time as I have and when has any manufacturer and to me the main one SAAM1 ever determined the bore of a shotgun at the muzzle end with or without choke tube. No this is a lawyer who interpreted it WRONG

The government followed SAAM1 and industry standard which is what anyone that knows shotguns would do even browning as they show on their web page

 This IMO was a membership drive that went real wrong for them and cost them members. Mine included after over 30 years

Yes everyone hates the government but they are not wrong this time and don't have to change anything CSSA is the issue

 Take care

 

Browning