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I am only referring to the 44-40 items...since this topic is about the 44-40. And yes, the brass cases changed, never said they never did (modern vs vintage). I said the bullets didn't.

If you want to see how the Winchester 44-40 brass changed over the years...here is a good example.
Here is some examples of some early 44-40 components from early manufactures.
Honestly not really interested in the 44 40 brass sorry never reloaded it or owned one I had enough experience with their brass over the years to only buy lapua now and that was in common calipers and like I said only reason I posted was to share brass quality is not what it once was since covid with some manufacturers so watch when buying that is all
Cheers
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
After a quick set of measurements i know this...
.44 exp .429 dia projectiles
The mouth of the brass is .427
The expander is .428 in the 4440 set, the expander in the .44 is .430

Ill try to resize using the 44 dies then seat and crimp with the 4440dies
 

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After a quick set of measurements i know this...
.44 exp .429 dia projectiles
The mouth of the brass is .427
The expander is .428 in the 4440 set, the expander in the .44 is .430

Ill try to resize using the 44 dies then seat and crimp with the 4440dies
See if that helps!!!!!!



Superslickie, the 44-40 can be complicated to explain so I will keep trying.....I like to learn too so this helps me learn how to explain.
200gr XTP,
I think the 200gr XTP 44 cal. bullet is definitely .430"

federal brass
Can you tell me what the headstamp says?

I've got the 4 die setup and can get everything done fine until it comes to seating the bullet,
what manufacture are the dies? Lee will be the .427" die while RCBS "Cowboy" will be for the lead .429" bullets

the expander doesn't go deep enough to allow the bullet to seat fully before crushing the cases. The expander goes all the way in to the stop but only expands for 1/8 inch, ive taken the die apart to check for issues and found nothing.
This doesn't sound right...not sure how to reply. The expander plugs are different designs for each manufacture. For example, Lee has a powder through expander plug that is only about .290" long. Is this the die you are describing?
I can not post photos to help for a visual but I have them on the 44-40 web site here: Chasing the 44-40 - Die Sets
Photo links won't work for me.

This is my first time reloading for this cartridge but I've been reloading for over 20years.
The 44-40 is an extremely multifaceted cartridge and is difficult to grasp unless the loader understands the history of the cartridge itself, how it was designed, why and the changes it went through over the years. From the black powder designs to the early smokeless powder designs. It just might take some time for me to start following the explanations from the posts.

What am i missing? I had 36 1x brass and am now down to 20 trying things on my own. I cant afford factory stuff at $2+/round
To me it sounds like the .430" XTP bullets are too big for the case neck that has been resized for .4255" bullets. The expander plug you are using is not expanding the case neck all the way down to the case taper. If you were to use a resizing die made for the .429" bullets, it should not crumple the case. I use the Lee die explained to load the .4255" diameter bullets and there is still a bit of Wasp Waist" under the base of the bullet where the case neck is still not expanded. What this means is that you are using 44-40 (.427") dies for a 44 Magnum (.430") bullets.

For .430" bullets you need a complete set of dies for those rather than for the .427" bullets.

My advise for using the .430" 200gr XTP bullets,
1. RCBS 44-40 Resizing/Decaping Die (they are cut for .429" bullets)
2. Lyman 44 Magnum "M" expander die
3. RCBS 44-40 Seating Die (do not use the roll crimp function for the shallow crimp grooves on the jacketed bullets. Use the roll crimp with lead bullets with deep crimp grooves.)
3a. The Redding 44-40 Profile Crimp Die will not work on .430" bullets, or at least they don't work for me.
4. Lee FCD 44-40 (do not crimp too hard, the collet will not close all the way and you can damage the case mouth). The LFCD is cut for use with .427" bullets with shallow crimp grooves.

I have all of this explained in detail on the 44-40 website if you can get to it.
sites.google.com/view/44winchester/chasing-the-44-40/ballistics-handloading/handloading



Honestly not really interested in the 44 40 brass sorry never reloaded it or owned one
Well there...there that is!
 

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Just FYI, Remington 44-40 R4440W is not a 240gr bullet unless it was a special manufacture for Canada. It has been reported that Remington stopped manufacturing 44-40 cartridges in 2007.

I know you guys may have laws with ordering ammo from other countries but gunbrokers is a good place to look at stuff.
Gun brokers is not an option for most canadians I am a member because I am dual and seen as a yank and have US address down there still . That being said I have not bought there in a few years since after 911 and it became so difficult to get items across the border firearm related All of the ammo from remington comes from the US to us and cannot see it being special order for what is sold here where is this date of 2007 coming from
 

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Gun brokers is not an option for most canadians I am a member because I am dual and seen as a yank and have US address down there still . That being said I have not bought there in a few years since after 911 and it became so difficult to get items across the border firearm related All of the ammo from remington comes from the US Where this this date of 2007 coming from
That is another of the multi country tricky issues. What might be available to Canada might no be available in the US. A lot of what folks see for sale in many areas is still a surplus of old stock. 44-40 Remington cartridges has not been manufactured for US since about 2007.

Similarly with Winchester's model 1894 rifle. Winchester manufactured their Model 94' chambered in 44-40 only to Canada although some seemed to find their way back to the US. The Only 94's sold in the US chambered for the 44-40 were the Commemorative versions.

The differences between 44-40 items in Canada and the US are very interesting.
 

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Cannot see the end of the box but listed as 4440 in 240 as I posted but that box to me looks like original remington boxes not what I have seen so far from rem arms View attachment 99468
For starters that is not even a 44-40 cartridge, looks like a 243. I'll see if I can skew the photo to be able to read the side label...interesting. The 44-40s were sold as a box of 50, those are a box of 25. Looks like those folks selling whatever that is is just using this Remington stock photo rather than a 44-40 box photo. I am still interested about the 240gr part. Also, I found the link and it states out of stock
 

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That is another of the multi country tricky issues. What might be available to Canada might no be available in the US. A lot of what folks see for sale in many areas is still a surplus of old stock. 44-40 Remington cartridges has not been manufactured for US since about 2007.

Similarly with Winchester's model 1894 rifle. Winchester manufactured their Model 94' chambered in 44-40 only to Canada although some seemed to find their way back to the US. The Only 94's sold in the US chambered for the 44-40 were the Commemorative versions.

The differences between 44-40 items in Canada and the US are very interesting.
and from the box pic I would say that it what this is
 

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For starters that is not even a 44-40 cartridge. I'll see if I can skew the photo to be able to read the side label...interesting.
I know that Jesus it is more than likly a file pic they use for all calipers and hoping they did show the actual ammo just know they are selling 240 4440 here for 99 bucks which I said before is nuts IMO
 

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Like I said I know nothing about this caliper but it seems 2009 was the last production and 2007 last catalog offering and looking at that box it is the same as what is shown for 99 bucks so has to be old stock being still sold here which would not shock me with a 4440 round
Take care
 

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Like I said I know nothing about this caliper but it seems 2009 was the last production and 2007 last catalog offering and looking at that box it is the same as what is shown for 99 bucks so has to be old stock being still sold here which would not shock me with a 4440 round
Take care
Oh yeah, my bad. I was posting off memory and I was close...but the brain ain't what it used to be...BTW, that's my website ;-)
 

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Oh yeah, my bad. I was posting off memory and I was close...but the brain ain't what it used to be...BTW, that's my website ;-)
cool it is a nice site with a ton of information for those into these Nice job on it by the way So that would make you savvy jack here ?? I have visited this site in the past
Take care
 
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