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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I didn't see a firearms/ hunting media section....and it relates to long guns...well, guns they were long guns...now they are prohibited so hand them over.


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http://www2.canada.com/nanaimodailynews/news/story.html?id=5957717

RCMP to confiscate more guns before registry ends

Jeff Davis, Postmedia News
Published: Friday, January 06, 2012


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With the firearms registry on death's door, the RCMP are using what little time remains to reclassify and seize certain scary-looking guns from Canadian firearms owners.

Among the guns being seized is a small-calibre varmint rifle called the Armi Jager AP80. Like many non-restricted rifles, it is semi-automatic and fires the .22-calibre bullet, the smallest and weakest used in any long gun.

The AP80 has been singled out because it looks too much like the infamous AK-47 assault rifle, although it shares no parts or technical similarities with that infamous battle rifle.

On Dec. 20, the RCMP Canadian Firearms Program - the office charged with administering gun control regulations in Canada - served hundreds of registered firearms owners with a "notice of revocation."

"This notice is to inform you that the firearm registration certificates indicated below have been revoked," says the letter, obtained by Postmedia News. "You have 30 days to deliver your firearms to a peace officer, firearms officer . . . or to otherwise lawfully dispose of them."

The letter says the AP80 was "incorrectly registered" in the past, and is being banned because it is now considered a member of the AK-47 family.

"The above mention firearm is prohibited as a variant of the design of the firearm commonly known as the AK-47 rifle," the letter says.

Until Dec. 20, the AP80 was classified as a non-restricted firearm, the most lightly controlled category of firearms in Canada. It has now been moved to most tightly controlled category: the prohibited firearms list.

As a result, the AP80 can now be owned or used only by people possessing certain rare "grandfathered" prohibited licences.

The RCMP also issued a notice of revocation for the Walther G22 rifle on Dec. 30. This gun, also a .22-calibre semi-automatic, was prohibited because it has a removable "bullpup" style shoulder stock.

The Walther G22 vaguely resembles the Beretta Storm carbine, used in the Dawson College shootings.

The letters say nothing about compensating gun owners for the seizures.

Michael Patton, a spokesman for Public Security Minister Vic Toews, said these recent changes do not foreshadow a broader reclassification effort.

"As classification of firearms is a manual process, from time to time there are errors that need to be corrected," he wrote in an email. "However, let me be clear: there is no plan to broadly reclassify firearms."

Ottawa firearms lawyer Solomon Friedman says the consequences could be severe for any owners who don't comply with the confiscation notice.

"If you don't surrender this without compensation, the RCMP can come to your home, seize it and charge you with possession of a prohibited firearm," he said.

Friedman says some owners of the AP80 are considering challenging the seizure order in court.

Under current firearms law, bureaucrats at the Canadian Firearms Program can reclassify any firearm through orders-in-council. Such reclassifications are done without parliamentary input or oversight.

Friedman said this confiscation effort contradicts the spirit of Bill C-19, the Harper government's legislation that will relax gun control, which is currently before the House. He noted the RCMP served its letters of confiscation while MPs were away on holidays.

Moving these firearms into higher classification brackets means their owners will still have to register them even after the Harper government's firearms law passes.

By changing classifications now, the RCMP will retain records of these owners even after the long-gun-registry data is destroyed.

Friedman says activist bureaucrats at the Canadian Firearms Program are using what little time remains to move more firearms into the restricted and prohibited categories.

"Remember, once the gun registry is eliminated, the RCMP will lose their ability to identify, target and harass law-abiding owners on non-restricted firearms," he said. "They only took notice of (the AP80) when the gun registry is in its death throes."

Friedman says there is a broader movement at the Canadian Firearms Program to seize small-calibre rifles that are dressed up to look like assault weapons.

They include .22-calibre semi-automatics made to resemble guns such as the M-16 assault rifle and MP5 submachine-gun used by police and military.

Tony Bernardo, executive director of the Canadian Sports Shooting Association, says the RCMP is in the midst of a "campaign of confiscation."

He said his membership is "appalled" by these efforts.

He described the AP80 and G22 as "plinking" rifles, better for little more than shooting tin cans for target practice. Bernardo called the confiscation effort "silly" and "shameful."

"These things are not assault rifles; they're .22s like every farm kid has," he says. "They happen to look racy, but that doesn't make them any deadlier."

Bernardo said seizures like this only reinforce belief in the old gun freedoms adage: "Registration leads to confiscation."

He said the RCMP is "desperate" to seize as many firearms as it can, and to alter classifications to ensure the names of as many firearms owners as possible remain on the books.

"This has a tremendous impact on RCMP's credibility when it comes to firearms issues," he said. "They're making fools of themselves when they launch these kind of campaigns."

[email protected]

Twitter.com/JeffDavisOttawa
 

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It's disturbing how classification is apparently soley in the hands of the RCMP.It's also disturbing that with out consultation or debate,they can just proclaim a gun restricted or prohibited.I've lost a great deal of respect for the mounties and some of their antics over the last couple of years.If anybody thinks the battle for gun owners is over once the LGR is gone,your in for a rude awakening!If a long gun registry is ever brought in again,this is one cat who won't be registering the next time around.
 

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try not to look scary... or the rcmp might try and confiscate u
.... just another reason they have the image they do.. maybe they should clean their "own house" before going to someone elses...
 

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Things can change quickly can't they
 

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I think it is absolutely rediculas that an 'AK variant' is singled out and targeted, though an 'AR variant' is ok. Where is the sense in that? There is none! I believe there should not be any rifle singled out on looks. It's totally absurd!

Trav
 

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So now the gun registry turns into thier personal weapon to conviscate guns that were legally purchased...NICE! Whats next on their agenda semi autos.
 

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Travis , it's because the AK is Prohibited , the AR is only restricted , for now ...
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
found some more!

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2012/01/10/government-to-gun-owners-we-made-a-mistake-fix-it-for-us-or-go-to-prison/


Two small-calibre rifles have been suddenly reclassified by the RCMP-run Canadian Firearms Program. The rifles in question, the Armi Jager AP-80 and the Walther G22, are both unremarkable .22-caliber long guns. While any firearm is dangerous, .22-caliber firearms are among the weakest around - indeed, they're typically used to train rookie shooters basic firearm safety and operation.

Canadian law divides firearms into three categories, using complex technical criterion and a bevy of politically-motivated "exemptions", and citizens can only legally own firearms in the categories their licence covers. No further licences are issued for the third and highest category, prohibited. By declaring a new exemption and moving these rifles from the non-restricted list - the category subject to the least controls - to the prohibited list, the RCMP has essentially banned them for all but a constantly shrinking group of Canadians who owned prohibited-class firearms before the current gun control legislation was passed under Jean Chrétien.

That's bad. This is worse: Any citizen who already owns an AP-80 or G22, and does not already possess a rare prohibited-class licence, has been ordered to turn in their rifles within 30 days. Failure to do so will mean they are unlawfully in possession of a prohibited firearm, and subject to as much as 10 years behind bars. It doesn't matter if they purchased it legally, paid all the sales taxes, and have stored it safely ever since. The RCMP has declared that it was a mistake to allow citizens to purchase these firearms, and wants them turned in, pronto. Or else.

No apology for the error. No mention of monetary compensation. No exemptions made for people who already owned them. Just an order to hand them over or become a criminal. When a private citizen tries to do what the RCMP is doing, it's called theft. The RCMP's seizure of these (up-til-now) legally owned guns will be accomplished with the full weight of the state.

With the G22 rifle, the RCMP has at least a flimsy excuse for the reclassification- it says because the rifle can be easily shortened by removing the back end, it's too easily concealable to be a non-restricted rifle (the blame still lies with the government for making the mistake in the first place, but at least that's something). The decision to ban the AP-80, however, has no logic behind it at all. The RCMP claims that it was "incorrectly registered" as non-restricted because the AP-80 is a "variant of the design of the firearm commonly known as the AK-47 rifle" - a Soviet-designed military combat rifle.

Except … it isn't. At all. The AP-80 fires an entirely different (and much weaker) kind of ammunition, using a different internal mechanism and is built from completely different materials and components (precisely zero of the parts of the AP-80 and AK-47 are compatible or interchangeable). The only thing the AP-80 has in common with the AK-47 is its silhouette - when the AP-80 was designed, the manufacturer decided to make it look like the famous AK-47, for purely marketing reasons. As a rifle, the AP-80 is a completely unremarkable low-caliber plinker. Only by making it look like a famous military rifle could the company hope to sell many copies, so that's what they did. The RCMP is banning the AP-80 because it looks scary.

Many Canadian firearms owners suspect that the federal Tories, once they scrap the long-gun registry, will lose interest in the firearms issue. They'll have kept their promise but, fearful of being painted by the media and opposition as pro-gun extremists, will move on. But even once the registry is gone, Canada's firearms laws will still be a mess - for proof of that, look no further than the above. Stepping in now to prevent this outrageous seizure of private property on the flimsiest of justifications would be a good place for the Tories to start showing Canada's lawful firearms owners that the Conservative party hasn't forgotten them just yet.

National Post
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So now the gun registry turns into thier personal weapon to conviscate guns that were legally purchased...NICE! Whats next on their agenda semi autos.
they've been trying take them since la peen shot up the school.... i own a few, and welcome them to try and take em
...
 

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Marc LePine used a ruger mini 14 in the shooting on L' Ecole Polytechnique in Montreal.This rifle(and the mini 30) is in the sights of the Lib's and NDP for banning and they make no bones about it.It's just the tip of the iceberg.
 

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pretty soon us hunters will only be able to carry slingshots.....although there will no doubt be a rock registry and only certain size rocks will be admissable
 

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I was just checking to see what the NFA's stance is on this reclassification. Apparently, they are instructing owners of these firearms how to fight this. Once again I'm proud to be a card carrying NFA member, and I wish everyone who owns firearms or believes in individual freedoms would at least buy a membership and throw in with these guys! I believe when the government tells you that you don't need your guns and wants to take them away is when you need them the most!
 

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The AP-80 fires an entirely different (and much weaker) kind of ammunition, using a different internal mechanism and is built from completely different materials and components (precisely zero of the parts of the AP-80 and AK-47 are compatible or interchangeable). The only thing the AP-80 has in common with the AK-47 is its silhouette - when the AP-80 was designed, the manufacturer decided to make it look like the famous AK-47, for purely marketing reasons. As a rifle, the AP-80 is a completely unremarkable low-caliber plinker. Only by making it look like a famous military rifle could the company hope to sell many copies, so that's what they did. The RCMP is banning the AP-80 because it looks scary.

Walther G22

 

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Ehclass, I understand that fact! Though I can't personally see the difference,... aside from the paperwork and perhaps the country of origin. (Goodness gracious, I also am NOT knocking the AR platform either! Personally I believe both platforms should be "legal", restricted or even non-restricted.) Just my 2 cents.

Trav
 

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they could have moved them to restricted and still had the gun owners names on a list.there is no need for them to make them prohibited weapons.soon they will start moving the restricted weapons to prohibited .like anything with a barrel shorter than the magic 18 inches.you would think these weapons that were moved would have to be put under restricted first.
 

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No argument from me Travis , I can't understand why the AK was prohibited instead of Restricted like the AR , ( AK is supposed to be easier to convert to full auto ) , or for that mater why any semi auto is even restricted let alone Prohibited !! And God only knows what they are thinking making a .22 rimfire restricted .... but it wasn't the first and certainly won't be the last ! Heck I don't even think my handguns should be restricted !! A VZ-58 looks like an AK and it isn't even restricted ...
 

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No argument from me Travis , I can't understand why the AK was prohibited instead of Restricted like the AR , ( AK is supposed to be easier to convert to full auto ) , or for that mater why any semi auto is even restricted let alone Prohibited !! And God only knows what they are thinking making a .22 rimfire restricted .... but it wasn't the first and certainly won't be the last ! Heck I don't even think my handguns should be restricted !! A VZ-58 looks like an AK and it isn't even restricted ...
it's as bad as the smith & wesson m&p 22.... they'll allow that, but not this
under the restricted tag... the only reason given for the s&w being restricted was the fact the mag well will accept an ar/m16 clip... the rifle can't fire that, what idiot would try that anyway
. but the buggers still slapped restricted on it.... it's a dedicated 22 and can't be converted... i know some guys igore the restriction and have use them for bunnies and plinking, anywhere they want, just for spite, and more power to em... out west they do use there ar's for hunting reguardless and who can blame em... they bought and paid for them, to me there just another semi... when u think of owning a gun now, u don't really own it, it's really more like your renting it from the rcmp, until they see fit to take them when they can think up an excuse to get them...
 

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Regarding KPR's videos of these .22cals on youtube,

To anyone that thinks this proves they should be banned, because they look evil and can shoot lots of bullets fast:

A common 10/22 that pretty much everyone owns can fire just as fast and hold just as many rounds........ run down to your local Ns gun store and grab some 30 round mags or a 50 round drum mag from here http://www.cabelas.c...e=10+22&x=0&y=0 (the store, I didnt look too hard but they had them last I checked).

Also note that the common "okay" looking 10 22 can be made to look just as "evil" as an ak47



also from the same above link

update- found that drum mag for the 10 22...it fits any common "hunting" 22........

http://images.cabela...6LdZx85zugnmX7N

I am against mag limits on any gun but comon...a 22?

anyone in favor of mag limits targeted against good honest citizens in an effort to prevent gun crime is missing the point entirely- we ain't criminals

humm...let me find a youtube vid of a 10/22 with this drum mag

ah, there we go, a fellow sport shooter enjoying his sport without needed to reload every 5 seconds- and no killing spree yet! He us using a common 10 / 22

 
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